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Alain Poitras a écrit:Il ne faut pas oublier que les gens buvaient leur vin dans des coupes de plomb dans ce temps là, comme le célèbre Néron qui avait mis le feu à la ville de Rome ...
Il souffrait peut-être également de schizophrénie, j'en ai connu un qui avaient quelquefois de profonds délires religieux.
Jesus in the Talmud
Peter Schäfer
Scattered throughout the Talmud, the founding document of rabbinic
Judaism in late antiquity, can be found quite a few references to
Jesus--and they're not flattering. In this lucid, richly detailed, and
accessible book, Peter Schäfer examines how the rabbis
of the Talmud read, understood, and used the New
Testament Jesus narrative to assert, ultimately, Judaism's
superiority over Christianity.
The Talmudic stories make fun of Jesus' birth from a
virgin, fervently contest his claim to be the Messiah
and Son of God, and maintain that he was rightfully
executed as a blasphemer and idolater. They subvert
the Christian idea of Jesus' resurrection and insist he
got the punishment he deserved in hell--and that a
similar fate awaits his followers.
Schäfer contends that these stories betray a remarkable familiarity with
the Gospels--especially Matthew and John--and represent a deliberate
and sophisticated anti-Christian polemic that parodies the New Testament
narratives. He carefully distinguishes between Babylonian and Palestinian
sources, arguing that the rabbis' proud and self-confident
countermessage to that of the evangelists was possible only in the unique
historical setting of Persian Babylonia, in a Jewish community that lived in
relative freedom. The same could not be said of Roman and Byzantine
Palestine, where the Christians aggressively consolidated their political
power and the Jews therefore suffered.
A departure from past scholarship, which has played down the stories as
unreliable distortions of the historical Jesus, Jesus in the Talmud posits a
much more deliberate agenda behind these narratives.
Table of Contents:
Chapter 1: Jesus' Family 15
Chapter 2: The Son/Disciple Who Turned out Badly 25
Chapter 3: The Frivolous Disciple 34
Chapter 4: The Torah Teacher 41
Chapter 5: Healing in the Name of Jesus 52
Chapter 6: Jesus' Execution 63
Chapter 7: Jesus' Disciples 75
Chapter 8: Jesus' Punishment in Hell 82
Chapter 9: Jesus in the Talmud 95
Appendix: Bavli Manuscripts and Censorship 131
Notes 145
Bibliography 191
What the Talmud Really Says About Jesus
http://www.publishersweekly.com/article/CA6411679.html
by David Klinghoffer, Religion BookLine -- Publishers Weekly, 1/31/2007
Will Peter Schaefer's new book, Jesus in the Talmud (Mar.), be
controversial? "I'm afraid so," Schaefer told RBL. "That's why I'm
nervous."
His editor at Princeton University Press, Brigitta van Rheinberg, laughed
but agreed: "You think, oh, whoa, this is not going to go over well in
certain circles."
Schaefer, who heads up Princeton's Judaic studies program, has collected
and analyzed all the passages in the Talmud that apparently refer to the
founder of Christianity, texts that were previously censored from Talmud
editions for centuries. In his book he argues—against other scholars—that
the scandalous passages indeed refer not to some other figure of ancient
times but to the famous Jesus of Nazareth.
What exactly is so scandalous? How about Jesus punished in Hell
for eternity by being made to sit in a cauldron of boiling
excrement? That image appears in early manuscripts of
the Babylonian Talmud, as does a brief account of Jesus'
trial and execution—not by the Romans but by the Jewish
high court, the Sanhedrin. The Jewish community, to the
extent Jews were even aware of these excised texts, has
been content to let them remain obscure and unknown.
Schaefer, a distinguished German-born Christian scholar who describes
classical rabbinic literature as "my first love," has now definitively let the
cat out of the bag. This undermines a widespread assumption that, of
Judaism's and Christianity's respective sacred texts, only the Christian
Gospels go out of their way to assail the rival faith, whereas Judaism's
classical texts refrain from similar attacks.
It seems fair to say now, however, that the Talmud is
every bit as offensive to Christians as the Gospels are to Jews.
The Talmud's scattered portrait of Jesus unapologetically
mocks Christian doctrines including the virgin birth and the
resurrection. Which isn't to say that the rabbinic invective is
meant simply to insult. In his book, the author calls the
Talmud's assault on Christian claims "devastating."
"It is a very serious argument," said Schaefer, who emphasizes that
the rabbis' stories about Jesus were never intended as an attempt at
historically accurate narrative. Rather, in the classic Talmudic style,
they encode legal and theological argumentation in the form of
sometimes-imaginative storytelling.
One naturally wonders, when Jesus in the Talmud is published, what the
results will be for Jewish-Christian relations. "I certainly don't want to
harm Jewish-Christian dialogue. God forbid," Schaefer said. But dialogue
requires honesty, and "I'm trying to be honest."

Ambre a écrit:Et comment appelles-tu un jeune qui se fait épouser, entretenir par une femme agée mais très riche?
UN GIGOLO
Et comment appelles-tu un vieux qui se tape une pauvre gamine?
UN PEDOPHILE
Et un type qui passe son temps à massacrer ceux qui ne se convertissent pas à la religion qu'il vient d'inventer pour expliquer que ses outrances sont la volonté d'Allah?
M . H . M . T


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